PHIL HUBBART THE GOAT

 When speaking of legends of the REGJB, there are a few men and women who stand above all others. Phil Hubbart, the man who shaped the Public Defenders office from a doormat into a powerful advocate for clients and later became a judge on the 3rd DCA is one of those legends. 

Image copied without permission from Mr. Markus

                                            

David Markus has Phil Hubbart on his Podcast and it's worth a listen. You can check it out by going to his excellent blog here (plus he could use the clicks for his stats). 

Apple Podcast here.  Spotify here.  DOM is such a trendsetter. First with the blog, and now podcasts. Can a DOM TIKTOK be far behind? 

 Also buy Hubbart's new book "From Death Row To Freedom" his journey in helping exonerate Pitts and Lee from death row (not that we prosecute innocent people, not even when certain State Attorneys Offices play Chess with discovery in death cases and coordinate witness testimony so it sounds better). 

DeSantis drones are saying "Wait, a retired judge helped exonerate two men from death row? That doesn't sound kosher to me." 

Speaking of innocent people on death row, The NY Times has this on the regrets of a Texas sheriff who put a man on death row for killing his daughter. Our biggest take- the sheriff turned his attention to the father, when at the hospital he noticed the man wasn't expressing any remorse. What he learned later is the man is AUTISTIC and doesn't express emotion. Also- the discrediting of the shaken-baby "science". No- for you ASAs and DeSantis Drones reading this, we are NOT in favor of any form of child abuse, including that which tragically kills children. We are against prosecuting innocent people in the deaths of children. 

And finally,

HAPPY BIRTHDAY HARRY POTTER

7/31/1980

MONDAY MONDAY

 How was your summer weekend?

In no particular order, here are some things on our mind. 

The Miami SAO ("Now that Satz is gone, proudly carrying the torch for being unreasonable") continues to investigate public defenders while ignoring the patent obstruction of justice by their own top prosecutor. 

In Oklahoma, teachers MUST teach the bible. Query? What  part of the bible? New and Old Testament? Or just the New stuff? What about the Koran? And Budda? In for a penny, in for a pound. 

NY Times has the coverage here. 

DEA agents joked about rape. And then one raped a woman.  AP article here. 

Gerald Ford was asked if and when a woman would be president. His answer?  The first woman president would assume the office as a vice president after the president died in office. Old Gerry was smarter than we give him credit for. 

Historic Vids on X: "President Gerald Ford's in 1989 when asked for advice on how a woman could become president https://t.co/ZfSFT14gRS" / X

This  sheriff in Texas really really wanted to prosecute librarians for allowing teenagers to check out certain books. Wouldn't you love to have a discussion of literature with this lunkhead? 

Hmmm.. maybe just maybe there is a retired Miami Prosecutor in Georgia looking for something to do. Withholding exculpatory discovery is just a few steps from burning books. 

And something fun to help you get through the hot Miami Monday blues. 

BEST PLACES TO TRY A CASE

 Where are the best places to try a case? 

In no particular order:

Southern District of New York. Walking into the Thurgood Marshall courthouse always gives us chills. Downside- many of the courtrooms are small and in a lot of them the defense sits behind the prosecution. Of course that allows us to make faces at them without them seeing it. Additional plus- walking distance from Chinatown and Wo Hops. And nothing cooler than riding a Citi bike from our hotel to the courthouse. Downside- the prosecutors are complete ______(rhymes with sticks).  MDC Brooklyn is awful for clients. But you know how difficult it is to get electronics into FDC Miami? At MDC Brooklyn you just fill out a form and you and your laptop are in. At FDC Miami you need a handwritten note from Merrick Garland, and that's one of the easier hoops to jump through. Try getting someone from FDC legal on the phone. It's easier to get Kim Jong Un on the phone. Their voice mail should say "You have reached FDC legal. Good luck leaving a message and getting us to return it sucker."   Case in point-  we recently had an issue with our access to MDC Brooklyn and on the day before Memorial Day, a lawyer at MDC Brooklyn legal responded to our email and renewed our access for a year.  Mark us down as a fan. 

Boston Massachusetts.  The courthouse is beautiful and the hallways have a great view of the Back Bay. The marshals all call you "counselah" as do many of the judges. We love Boston. So many places to hang and have a beer and chowdah. Prosecutors are decent as are the judges. Downside- the jail for clients detained is in...ready for this? Rhode Island. About an hour drive from Boston. 

Los Angeles. We just like the vibe of LA. 

Dallas (Northern District of Texas).  We are not a fan. First, Dallas has a weird vibe. You can stand right where President Kennedy was killed and feel the history of the 1960's being changed. The prosecutors are hit or miss- we have  had really good ones, and really awful ones. Biggest surprise- standing when the Judge walked in and having him asking us to remain standing while he prayed to his "lord and savior Jesus Christ".  Sort of an uncomfortable moment. 

Middle District of Florida. Used to hate and we mean HATE Miami lawyers in the 80s and 90's, Like Broward type hate. Things have been better recently. 

Southern District of Georgia (Savanah). Nothing better than walking to court from the hotel and having every single person you pass on the way stop and wish you a good morning. The marshals asked if we were a lawyer and when we said we were, they ushered us through security after looking at the bar card. 

Northern District of Illinois (Chicago). It's Chicago. Deep Dish Pizza. Chicago-style dogs. Really good hotels near the courthouse and there is the Loop. Downside- it's really cold in the winter. But one of our fav memories was recently walking a lead defendant in a lengthy fraud conspiracy trial where several of the co-defendants (whose counsel were very rude to us during the whole trial for reasons we need not get into, but basically they didn't like not having a local lawyer going first on cross, etc) were convicted, and having the judge excuse us while mayhem erupted over the inconsistent verdicts and we just strolled away. 

Eastern District of New York  (Brooklyn).  Old facility. But the prosecutors are much better than SDNY and Brooklyn has undergone a revitalization. The court borders Brooklyn Heights, so there is Montague street for great lunch and dinner restaurants. But stay in nearby Williamsburgh which back in the 80's was a war zone, but now is populated by aging Boomers, and Gen Zers. Hotels have a great vibe and there are steakhouses, sushi places, and Indian joints galore, not to mention cool coffee houses and indie bookstores. 

DEAR KATHY WE ARE GOING TO SIT IN YOUR OFFICE

 Not exactly a love letter. 

Prediction ( we are good at these- see our Biden dropping out prediction last week two days before he did)  your State Attorney will...DO NOTHING. 

She will not respond. 

She has not done anything although one of her now former prosecutors arguably obstructed justice. 

So Rumpole has an idea. An old idea actually. 

Her office wants to investigate and arrest PDs. Let's do a SIT IN. 

Non-violent protest. Until our State Attorney agrees to address these issues, including an independent oversight board for the convictions of her office that are now suspect, criminal defense attorneys sit in her office. At both sides of the SAO blocking ingress and egress and if necessary, like other protestors before us, get arrested. If MLK and John Conyers and thousands of others did it, we can do it. Let's take it to the streets! 

We will win and she will break if swarms of us continue to sit in her office demanding action. 

Now, we are willing to put our money where our mouth is- and sit in with our colleagues, but we have a small trip coming up shortly, so we need to schedule this sit in, as we don't want to read about our colleagues in jail while sipping a Negroni in the Alps. 

Here is the FACDL's decidedly unlove letter to our State Attorney. 

Statement on the SAO's Targeting of Defense Lawyers by Anonymous PbHV4H on Scribd

THIS MOMENT IN TIME

 “There are decades when nothing happened and weeks when decades happen” Lenin was reportedly to have said. 

Now are those weeks when decades are happening. 

An older person, with decades of admirable service to community is seeing all they built crumble around them. They appear frozen in the headlights, unable to respond as they did in their younger days- when confidence and talent carried the day. 

And then there is Joe Biden. 

But first our State Attorney. 

When did she surround herself with sycophants, all assuring her that her top prosecutor who goes by the initials MVZ knew what he was doing? When did the hallmark of honesty and integrity become replaced by a win at all costs attitude? For decades prosecutors had to deal with cops who stretched the line of truth because they “knew” the defendant was guilty and did not trust the system. Then, slowly, Miami Prosecutors (at least some of them) adopted the same philosophy. And now, faced with the biggest scandal in the history of the once proud Miami State Attorneys Office, our State Attorney stubbornly and steadfastly refuses to allow outside oversight over their convictions - not even the ones obtained by MVZ who has been proven to be a liar, and possibly worse. (There is a name for turning a blind eye to illicit drug use and sexual assignations). Where is the criminal investigation for obstruction of justice? The SAO is investigating two assistant PDs for possibly telling a witness to not appear. But they do nothing when MVZ coordinates the testimony of jailhouse snitches and then lies about it? Really?? 

Speaking of stubborn, as KFR says everything is ok, so does her aging counterpart at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. Also surrounded by sycophants, his staff gaslighted the news media and the Democratic Party a year ago as rumors of his age, illness and infirmity began to circulate. And what have they wrought? Nothing other than handing over the White House to a convicted felon and party bent on destroying American ideals, unless your view of American ideals is isolationism,  xenophobia, and a cult of personality. 

We will be held accountable  in both Miami and by the world,  if we standby while the concepts of justice and America are torn apart. 

Maybe a few judges and ASAs should read what happened to James Joseph Richardson - wrongfully convicted of the murder of his seven children and sentenced to death. He was exonerated and rereleased after a State Attorney and her staff proved his innocence. 

That State Attorney? Janet Reno and the Miami Dade State Attorneys Office (with the investigation led by Asa Don Horn) back when justice was their highest calling- not coordinating the statements of jail house snitches. 

In Europe world leaders fret and make plans for the next Trump Administration, with a vice president who wants to abandon Ukraine who is fighting Russia alone as England fought Hitler alone in 1939-1942.  

It takes a lifetime to build a reputation. And it can be lost in a minute by the actions of MVZ or DT. 

Churchill and Roosevelt and Eisenhower were men who met the moment. Janet Reno was the woman who time and time again told her prosecutors to go where the evidence led them- winning was at the bottom of the list. Justice was at the top. 

Where are these people when we need them now? 

(Ps we wrote this early Sunday before the Biden announcement but decided to run it anyway. You get the point. Well, we shouldn’t assume that should we? Some of you get the point.  The rest are busy reading MAGA crap about Harris not being eligible to be president or Hillary using Hunter’s laptop to trick the media into not reporting how ill Biden was. Speaking of old age - whose age is an issue for the presidency now? Lmfao ). 

BIDEN OUT

 Update: It occurs to us the enormity of the decision of the president. The last president supported a mob who stormed the capitol looking to hang his vice president. His lawyers filed  frivolous lawsuits across the country - losing them all and their bar licenses as well. He tried to hang on to power for his own aggrandizement and personal profit.  

Need we compare that to what just occurred? A man walking away from what he always aspired to for the good of the county? (Save us your emails and comments about how he was forced. They ring hollow in comparison to the lawsuits and “hang Mike Pence” chants as well as his encouragement for Pence to violate the constitution.)  

Lest we forget. Only one candidate for president is a 78 year old convicted felon.  

Who is too old to be president? 

“Teach them how to say goodbye”

Alexander Hamilton 

AS WE PREDICTED THIS WEEK 

PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN HAS WITHDRAWN 

FROM HIS RACE TO BE RE ELECTED AS PRESIDENT 

Now it’s going to get fun  

We neglected to mention Pete Buttigieg as a potential candidate   Biden just endorsed his VP Kamala Harris - but Pete B is super duper smart and sometimes that works for the 52% of Americans who aren’t anti intellectual. Trump would be advised  not to debate either of them  

1202 ALARM ( REPEAT)

We repeat our post on the Apollo 11 Moon landing, 55 years ago todabecause our post was so exceptionally well written. 

 The fascinating part of the historic Apollo 11 landing on the moon (50 years ago today) is the handling of the 1202 and 1201 alarms during the decent of the Eagle to the lunar surface.

Some Apollo-nerd stuff that you only get here: The Eagle's computer had three programs to run from the time it undocked to landing. The first was P63: which controlled Eagle from undocking while it was still in orbit to powered-descent. P63 controlled the attitude (pitch and yaw) of Eagle and ran the burn which took Eagle out of orbit and into a controlled descent to the lunar surface. PDI (powered-descent initiation) occurred about 500 kilometers east of the landing site and 12 minutes to landing. The first go-no-go from Houston after the go-no-go for undocking was for PDI. When the Eagle is three minutes from landing and 7K/M from the site, the computer ran P64. The P64 program pitched the Eagle forward and gave Armstrong a view of the lunar surface so he could check for landmarks. At this point the computer is telling the astronauts and Houston where it intends to land. If you listen to the raw landing tapes, the guidance officer in Houston is indicating that they are headed for a spot longer down-range than anticipated. 

When the Eagle is 600 meters from the landing site, Armstrong activates P66 in which he and the computer share the throttle while Armstrong alone controls the descent. 
Somewhere along the way a switch was flipped powering on the rendezvous radar that was supposed to be off. The rendezvous radar began feeding more information to the computer than it was designed to handle at exactly the wrong time- during the dangerous descent phase. How Armstrong and NASA handled this critical error is the stuff legends are made of.

As PDI begins, Houston immediately loses signal and data from Eagle, prompting a call to Collins in Colombia to tell Aldrin to re-aim an antenna. Meanwhile Neil Armstrong has several issues to contend with, including no communication with the men who are supposed to guide him. 

As the Eagle descended Armstrong began to realize that the guidance computer was taking him farther down range then it was supposed to and was putting the Eagle into a crater. The Eagle has two guidance systems: PGNS (pings) is the main system, and AGS is the back-up. Both Houston and Aldrin  are monitoring both systems and comparing their data to see if it matches as the Eagle descends towards history. 

As  P63 turns the Eagle around so that now it's Engine is facing the lunar surface, the landing radar and other radar (that's supposed to be off) both lock on to the lunar surface. The computer is overloaded with data, and now come the words that almost ended the mission: "1202...1202 alarm."  Eagle is 33,500 feet above the surface of the moon. 

In the simulator Armstrong and Aldrin had practiced with several different scenarios, including the loss of various functions of the Eagle, wrong indicators, loss of communication, and the like. But in the thousands of hours of training, they had never encountered a 1202 alarm.

Here is what happened on the ground in Houston and their success showed why NASA was able to achieve the extraordinary moon landing:

Gene Kranz was the flight director, later responsible for the saying "failure is not an option". Kranz was the one who made the final decision to allow the Eagle to land. 
Jack Garman was an engineer and part of the team working on the computers and the landing guidance system of the Eagle. At a meeting several weeks before the landing, Kranz told Garman to write down every possible alarm and the response to the alarm.
Steve Bales was the guidance officer who was one of the men responsible to answer Kranz during various "Go-No-Go" calls when Houston had to tell Armstrong if he could continue to land.
Astronaut Charlie Duke was "cap-com" the man responsible for speaking directly to Aldrin and Armstrong. 

Several seconds after the 1202 alarm, Armstrong having heard nothing from Houston, asked "give us a reading on that 1202 alarm."  When you listen to Armstrong, there is some uncertainty in his voice. He is about 30,000 feet above the surface of the moon and less than seven and half minutes from landing. He is looking for a place to land, watching his fuel, working on the high-gain antenna issue, and now an alarm that he does not recognize is going off which may cause the mission to be aborted. 

Meanwhile in Houston, when the alarm went off, Kranz was looking towards his guidance officer Bales or anyone else who knew what the alarm was. Nobody knew. There were blank stares all around as Krantz's landing team started scrambling though massive three-ring binders looking for what a 1202 alarm was. Eventually Krantz asked Bales and Bales called over to a back room where there were dozens of engineers One of them- Jack Garman - knew what the alarm meant.  

Apollo 11's computer's were rudimentary. The landing radars started giving the computer more data than it could handle. When this occurred the computer had a line of programing to tell it to prioritize its work and to trigger a 1202 alarm to let Houston and the Eagle know what it was doing. Essentially the computer was rebooting without shutting down. If the computer had shut down, Kranz would have ordered an abort. 

Garman reasoned that as long as the alarm didn't continually repeat, which would mean the computer was in a non-recoverable loop, that they were "go" on the alarm. Garman told Bales. Bales told Kranz. Kranz told Duke and Duke told Armstrong. 

There was another 1202 alarm and then a 1201 alarm at 27,000 feet above the surface. Aldrin tells Houston about why he thinks the alarm is occurring. Meanwhile Garman quickly told Bales that the 1201 alarm was the same type of alarm as the 1202 and that they were "go" on that. 

Armstrong never doubted what Duke was telling him. Kranz had faith in Bales and Bales knew Garman knew the landing computer software better than anyone. 

At about 9 minutes into the landing, and 5200 feet about the surface the computer switches to P64 and the program pitches Eagle over so that the attitude of the Eagle is more upright, and it begins to descend in the same attitude that it will have upon landing. Armstrong is now looking at the surface so he can find a place to land.  Kranz quickly runs through a "go-no-go" for landing and Retro (the controller monitoring the engines) FIDO (flight dynamics),  ECOM (electrical, environmental and consumables), Guidance  and the flight surgeon all give Kranz and enthusiastic "GO!" for landing which Charlie Duke relays to Aldrin and Armstrong. 

At 3,000 feet they get another 1201 alarm, but they are quickly told they are "go on that alarm" and the descent continues. In another minute, at 1300 feet they get another 1202 alarm, but they are still go to land. 

 At 600 feet the P64 program is steering the Eagle toward a sea of boulders and craters. Armstrong decides to switch to the P66 program and manually take control of Eagle. He began to use the thrusters to navigate the Eagle past a large crater and then looked for a relatively flat area to set his craft down on, all the while monitoring an ever-dwindling fuel supply and a host of other issues. 

The Eagle is 300 feet from the surface when Aldrin tells Armstrong that he is "pegged at horizontal velocity",  meaning they are going forward at the top speed on the indicator. At 250 feet Armstrong is now slowing the forward velocity. He sees a landmark he recognizes: "Little West Crater", and he pilots Eagle just past it where he sees a relatively smooth surface to land. The forward velocity has slowed from 50 feet/second to 19 feet/second. At 175 feet they have 94 seconds to land, or they will get a "fuel-bingo" call from Houston and will have to abort. 

The Eagle had one chance to land on the moon. If the landing was aborted, they would activate the ascent engine, fly back to Michael Collins in Colombia, and headed back to earth having failed in their attempt to land. There were no second chances on this flight. 

At 100 feet they have 75 seconds of fuel left.  Armstrong is now demonstrating why he was chosen for this mission- he is at the top of his game and pulling off the greatest landing in the history of aviation- and one of the most difficult and dangerous to boot. The man has met the moment.  Thousands of hours of training are paying off for the Apollo 11 landing team. 

At 75 feet the Eagle's velocity has slowed to six feet forward/per second. At 60 feet, Charlie Duke in Houston calls out "sixty seconds": they have a minute of fuel left to land. 

At 20 feet Charlie Duke calls out "thirty seconds". There is almost no fuel left to land. 

With seventeen seconds of fuel remaining Aldrin calls out "contact light": a 1.5-meter probe below Eagle has touched the surface and humans have landed on the moon.  

The team worked. The system worked, and Armstrong landed the Eagle with 17 seconds of fuel remaining. 

The first words spoken by a human being on another celestial body belong to Buzz Aldrin: "Contact light. Ok. Engine stop. ACA out of descent. Mode control both auto descent engine command override off. Engine arm off. 413 is in." 

Hardly memorable or historic words, but before Armstrong tells the world that from Tranquility Base "The Eagle has landed",  Aldrin had a checklist he needed to run through to make sure the descent engines were shut down and the abort-ascent engine couldn't be accidentally triggered. 

Charlie Duke responds "we copy you down Eagle".

Armstrong says "The Eagle has landed" and Duke responds that there were a bunch of guys about to turn blue but were breathing again. This is in response to the fact that with less than 30 seconds of fuel, the Eagle had not landed and everyone in mission control was holding their breath. 

A half a million people worked on some part of the Apollo program. But on July 20, 1969, it was Kranz, Steve Bales, and Jack Garman who gave the go ahead to Armstrong and Aldrin to continue the landing in the face of 1202 and 1201 alarms.

Brave and historic actions indeed.  And it is, in our humble opinion, humanity's finest hour. It reminds us that if we try together, we as a species can do great things. 

Happy Apollo 11 Moon Landing Day. 

THINGS THAT BOTHER US

 Being more than slightly cranky, if not misanthropic, here are things, in no particular order, that bug us: 

The federal form we fill out at FDC that requires us to tell them our car and license plate number. We are getting more and more exotic with our answers- our last one listed a Ferrari GTO and a plate number of NG123, and they didn't blink an eye. 

While we are at it on FDC- to bring in a laptop you still need President Biden to sign off on the request. You know what it takes to bring in a laptop at MDC Los Angeles or MDC Brooklyn? Just filling our a form. The same for the Dade Jails. What is the holdup here with the feds in Miami? 

Prosecutors who set plea offers to expire at 12 noon. Like if they got an email at 12:01 they would ignore it or say the offer had changed. 

County Court Judges who like to cite the rules of judicial administration when denying a motion to continue. Really? You are that full of yourself? 

Prosecutors and Judges who deny the existence of a trial tax. You are as believable as someone who denies global warming. 

Influencers. Because they annoy us. Just go away. 

People who crowd the gate at the airport in group seven. We are in group one. Get out of our way please we need time to settle into our seat in first class. 

People at the airport. 

Waiters who put on a show with the menu. Give us the menu. Tell us the specials and STFU please. 

People who use air quotes. 

People who are excessively interested in the bourbon for their old fashioned. We do not need some liquor that was aged in casks made from outhouses in Kentucky. Just make the drink. 

People who order egg white omelets. Eat a yolk. If you are worried, take a statin later. 

Vaccine deniers, Still. They bug us with their "I'm not putting anything in my body that I haven't researched". Like if they were dying of a burst appendix they would ask about the type of anesthesia being used. 

People offended by standup comics. Get a life. 

MAGA people- of course. 

Tip options for nearly every part of our life. Do not get us wrong-we want working class people to make a decent living. But it should be the store owner who pays their clerk a decent wage, and not have it left up to us to tip a dollar to the convenience store worker who puts our Ice Cream Cookie sandwich in a bag. 

Vaping.  Don't be stupid. 

Items that now require a subscription service. Case in point- compost machines. Rumpole has been composting since about 1980. But lately there are new types of machines that take your food refuse and create a dry powdery compost which you can then spread on your lawn. But- get this- these machines which look like small garbage cans, plug into the wall and connect to the internet- and they required a sixty plus dollar a month for a subscription fee!! So no thank you- we will just take that banana peel and take it outside to our compost bin and let nature take its course. 

SDNY prosecutors. You know who you are. 😡😠

Unsolicited emails telling us they have been on our website and know why we aren't getting clients. We cannot respond because we do not have the time because we are so BUSY with our clients. Just go away. 

Pig Butchering: Have you gotten the text message that is asking about someone else? It's usually something like "Hey Mary we are here waiting for you." Then you respond they have the wrong number. Then they respond that their assistant wrote in a wrong cell phone number but they are glad to meet you. This is a China based scam called "Pig Butchering" Google it. They usually send a picture of an attractive young Asian woman who claims to be a successful businessperson. They make friends. They flirt and at some point they let you know that they are making an extra 20K a month trading crypto and because you are now friends they will help you set up an account. Once you know the scam you can F with them. But we have worked with two older clients who were scammed for a whole lot of money and it is very sad, especially since the people behind the texts are working in labor camp type conditions in China and are untouchable. Be careful and warn your clients and family and friends please. 

And finally, to the idiot who sends us about 10 comments a day stating "I heard X quit at the SAO" with multiple variations- stop. We are not posting them and those are seconds out of our life to delete them we will not get back. Don't make us angry- we are 90% sure we know who you are.  

PREDICTION

 President Joseph Robinette Biden (the only president whose middle name is the sur name of a Miami legal Judicial legend - see below for more) will exit the race by this time next week. 

Political trivia- name the last sitting president who chose not to run for reelection. 

So now that Biden out is a nearly foregone conclusion, what is the path forward? Biden cannot assign his delegates to his Vice President. He must release them, which means we will have an open convention. So our next political trivia is when was the last open convention in the US? Who won? 

Who are your picks to be the democratic presidential nominee? We think the strongest choice is Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia.  The Governors of Pennsylvania, Michigan, New Jersey, Colorado and California are also in the running. And what about Senator Corey Booker of NJ? We haven’t heard much about him lately. 

For a political junkie like Rumpole, this is going to be loads of fun. 

And while the presidency is within the grasp of you know who, he is not there yet. 

Don’t believe us? Just ask Thomas Dewey or Al Gore. Not to mention Richard Mulhouse Nixon in 1960. 

REGJb Trivia answer. We had a county court Judge named Meek Robinette who spoke with a very thick southern drawl. He was not, to be kind, the sharpest knife in the drawer, so he was relegated to bond hearing duty twice a day where he said iconically “Unless ah state otherwhaise ah find probahable chause…” Let’s just say there was a gulf as wide as the Mississippi River between him and Judge Ed Cowart. But what a name! Meek as a first name is just so old school southern cool. And if you read about Judge Robinette you will learn that as a young man he was a U of M star athlete. Share your Meek Robinette stories with us and on X #MeekRobinette. 

SOCIAL MEDIA AND THE BAR

 This one is troubling. 

There was a trial in Northern Florida (Orange County Ninth Circuit Motto: "We ain't liberal Miami y'all and ninth is better than eleventh") in which an African American Doctor sued over his dismissal on grounds it was race related. He won. The jury awarded him 2.75 million. The trial judge reversed the verdict and dismissed the case.  Such is life in some parts of the US. Perhaps it was well founded in law. Perhaps it was not. 

MEMO TO BAR: WE ARE NOT CRITCIZING THE JUDGE 

Then a lawyer reposted on her social media account other posts criticizing the judge and calling for his removal. 

And your Florida Bar moved to sanction her. The referee agreed that she distributed false information about a member of the judiciary. Attached is the referee findings and the Amicus brief of the ACLU. 

What do you think of this?

Oh wait- it's a Northern Florida   issue. What do y'all think about this? Meet at the Piggly Wiggly to discuss. 

When we write that DeSantis appointed judges are latte sipping, balls and strikes calling drones who will do anything to write an order stating that the motion is denied because it is the function of the legislature and not the judiciary to make such policy decisions so that they catch the eye of the federalist society, are we headed for a bar complaint? Will the ACLU help us? Will Mr. Markus defend us?  Or are we doomed? 

What about when we repost the Kardashians?  What if a local judge owned a restaurant and we ate at it and called it worse than sewer swill and that anyone who owned such an establishment was lower than a pig in a poke?  Would the Bar come after us? Or just the NY Times Restaurant critic? 

Report of Referee - Brooke Girley by Anonymous PbHV4H on Scribd

ACLU BRIEF

ACLU Amicus by Anonymous PbHV4H on Scribd

OLD SCHOOL

 It used to be cooler to Zoom with Pooler.

Not anymore. 

The Judge is going old school with no Zoom Monday, Wednesday and Fridays. 

Why the Zoom hate? 

Appearing by Zoom takes cars off the roads- not that global warming is an issue employees of the State of Florida can discuss. They cannot- even in the porno-novels they may write. 

Zoom makes lawyers' lives easier. Some of our colleagues do not want to drive from Broward where they live to hear the state announce a nolle prosse, or that a client was accepted into PTI. 

And more importantly, many of our clients work two and three jobs (something our          30- something DeSantis drones do not identify with) and sometimes the difference in them being able to pay their rent or utility bill is that extra shift they pick up at Starbucks making our 30 something DenSantis drone's double iced latte. 

So what's the problem with Zoom? Despite Florida's strict prohibitions about mentioning the heat or the weather, don't we all want to be Cooler In Pooler (via Zoom)? 

ERLINGER V. US

 

The Supreme Court issued the opinion in Erlinger v. US this week. It is an opinion we have been waiting for for a long time as Florida courts have consistently refused to apply the decision in Apprendi and its progeny to Florida's oppressive sentencing statutes. Now comes the first crack in the wall.

And who better to explain the implications of the Big E decision than our own appellate superstar Dan Tibbett: 

Having spent a little time digesting Erlinger v. US, the US Supreme Court's decision means that Florida's system of sentencing enhancements, definitely including Habitual Violent Offender, Violent Career Criminal, and Prison Release Reoffender, and probably including Habitual Offender, is unconstitutional.  

Erlinger says, like Apprendi said 24 years ago, that any fact that increases the range of punishments a defendant faces, meaning either a minimum mandatory that would not otherwise apply or an increase in the maximum sentence, must be found by a jury.  Facially, it would sound like this obviously applies to HO, HVO, VCC, and PRR sentencing, but the State's argument, almost universally accepted by Florida judges so far, has always been that it does not because these enhancements depend on prior convictions, and prior convictions are an exception that can be determined by a judge, relying on Almendarez-Torres.  The Erlinger majority ( this part of the opinion is agreed on by 6 justices) basically says that Almendarez-Torres is probably wrong but nobody asked them to overrule it and they don't need to overrule it in this case so they won't at this time.  This language means it would be wise to preserve argument that it is unconstitutional to consider prior convictions not found by a jury at all, as probably Almendarez-Torres will get explicitly overruled in next few years.  However, Erlinger says that even if the prior convictions exception to Apprendi exists it applies ONLY to the judge determining "what crime, with what elements, the defendant was convicted of" in the prior case.  EVERYTHING else must be determined by a jury to be considered at sentencing. Documents about the prior convictions can only be consulted for the "limited function of determining the fact of the prior conviction and the then-existing elements of that offense".  In other words, the only reason a judge can find the date of a prior conviction is to figure out what the elements of the crime were on that date (this matters more for federal ACCA sentencing, which is what Erlinger was specifically about).

All of the Florida sentencing enhancements depend not just on the fact of the prior conviction but on a date that is used not to determine what the elements were but the actual fact of when the defendant committed the crime, was convicted of the crime, or was released from prison/probation for the crime.  You aren't an HO just for having 3 priors, you have to have been convicted of one of them or been released for one of them within 5 years of the current crime.  You aren't a HVO/VCC unless you were convicted/released on the enumerated felony within 5 years.  PRR obviously depends specifically on the prison release date.  None of these dates are the fact that a defendant was convicted of a certain crime, or elements of the prior conviction.  And none of them are determined by a jury in Florida.  The judge looks at a document and says yes this guy was convicted/released on x date.

The reason I said HO is probably unconstitutional and the others definitely are is that the others all impose a minimum mandatory.  HO does not have a min man but does increase the maximum, so it is slightly different, but certainly if the defendant is sentenced above the statutory max for that degree of felony this argument would apply.

In my view anyone with a sentencing for a client where the State is seeking any of these enhancements should become familiar enough with Erlinger to argue and preserve this issue.  Florida said that Apprendi was not retroactive and that would certainly be the State's argument with Erlinger also.  Also I can see no reason anybody should be stipulating to dates of priors when they were not determined by a jury.

Er Linger by Anonymous PbHV4H on Scribd

TRUMP FINE...NATION NOT

 We will give him this...his actions after his ear was hit by unfriendly fire were           Reagan-esque. Although The Gipper walked into the ER with a bullet in his chest quipping to Nancy "Honey I forgot to duck" and telling his ER surgeons "All in all I'd rather be in Philadelphia" , while 45 whined that he didn't want to leave his Buster Browns behind. And isn't that going to be the real conspiracy theory to come out of all of this- what was he doing speaking with his shoes off? 

Let's examine for a moment the issue of an assassin getting withing 300 yards of a former president, on a roof, with an AR 15. Putting aside that the secret service missed the man aiming a gun at the former president, wasn't 45's solution to school shootings to arm teachers? 

So if Donny Boy had a Sig 45 strapped to his waist, and if, as any MAGA moron will tell you, the right of Americans to own an assault rifle is in the bible  "And it shall come to pass that in the land between the waters they shall be armed with AR 15's sayeth the lord, and neigh shall anyone take them from them." Numbers, 21;3, then what pray tell would that gun have done if Lee Harvey 2.0's bullet had traveled a few millimeters to the right? Nothing. 45's head would have been blown off on television, making him a MAGA martyr, and Joe Biden, who clearly has Parkinson's disease,  (masked face, stilted gate, arms don't move when he walks, slow blin rate, jumbled speech...) would have moved back ahead in Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Georgia- three states he needs to win. 

Guns don't kill people, they just shoot their ears off. Duh. 

Where have you gone Abraham Zapruder, our troubled nation turns its weary eyes to you. 

No election should be decided by an assassin's bullet. We are glad he missed.  And listen closely when we tell you this folks, this is just the beginning of what is going to be the wildest presidential election yet.  

This race is far from over. 

Tis a long road that has no turns.

And now, because only his wittle bitty ear wuz hurt, some presidential assassination trivia. 

Name the last two presidential candidates to be shot before the conventions. Hint- one was a democrat, and one was a nut job. 

From whence did the expression "His name is Mud" come from? 

Miami was the scene of the attempted assassination of what president? 

Out of which assassination did the only female ever to swear in a president arise? 

This sitting president was attacked twice with guns within two weeks. 

These two presidents are linked because President 1's secretary had the same sur name as President 2, and President 2's secretary had the same sur name as President 1, and both presidents were assassinated one hundred years apart.

Which former president was shot in the chest while giving a speech and did not seek medical attention until he finished his speech? 

This president was shot at a Washington DC railroad station in July and died in September. Name the president and his assassin. 

When Lincoln passed, his Secretary of War Edward Stanton was reported to have said 
"Now he belongs to ___ _____". 

Leon F. Czolgosz, a man in desperate need of more vowels, shot this President on September 6. The President died on September 16. Czolgosz was prosecuted by Michael Von Zamft, (Who had some of the vowels Leon needed) and after discovery was quickly turned over, executed on October 29 of the same year after being found guilty. 

That's it, and thank you for playing Presidental Assassination Trivia.  

RUSTY

 Some thoughts on the dismissal of charges against Alec Baldwin because of the discovery violations in the case. 

Overwhelming first thought: That would NOT happen here in Miami- but for perhaps one or two judges in the REGJB. And you know who they are. 

2- Broward would remove the judge from the bench who had the temerity to dismiss a case for a discovery violation. And then disbar them. And then prosecute them for obstruction of justice. Mike Satz lives on.

3- This was live ammo placed in a gun handed to Alec Baldwin after telling him the gun was "cold" not loaded. The prosecution knew this months before the trial- and did NOTHING. One prosecutor resigned after the case was dismissed. 

4. Remarkably, we have a similar situation here in Miami- land of the Chess- Game- Discovery-Responses ( (c)  Michael Von Zamft and Kathy Rundle, 2018, all rights reserved). And what is being done? Some hand wringing over how this is a big nothing and pablum that the Miami SAO is the most ethical office in the land.   If you believe that one, then Joe Biden can beat you at Wordle. 

5- Back to our DeSantis drones. Can you imagine the scenario? The same situation unfolds, the prosecution is caught (K to Q 2) withholding exculpatory evidence and our 30 something DeSantis Drone races off to chambers, sweat dripping from their brow, calling every judge friend they can find, begging for a way to make a decision that does not dismiss the case and place them in the crosshairs of being called a liberal defense oriented judge who has one set of rulings for celebrities and  who legislates from the bench thus jeopardizing what has otherwise been in their mind a sure- Federalist Society paved path to the Florida Supreme Court as every day they deny motions while gravely explaining that the legislature has not authorized such a decision and the resolution lies in enacting new laws and not expanding them from the bench. 

Is it any wonder that we jump at the chance to take a case out of Florida? We have one in Indiana for gosh sakes, and another in Oklahoma, and even there, we are treated better than at the crossroads of 12th street and 12th avenue. 

Enjoy your weekend. Mr. Baldwin surely is. 

Well done to his defense team after a slow start. Well done indeed. 

Neal Sonnett Has Passed Away

 Neal Sonnett,  a legendary Miami criminal defense attorney with a nationwide reputation as one of the finest criminal defense attorneys of his generation has passed away. 

We never worked on a case with Mr. Sonnett, but from our earliest days he was a presence in Miami state and federal courts. And as his career progressed, he developed a national reputation.  He was a lawyer's lawyer- the lawyer that a criminal defense attorney kept in his/her  mind as the lawyer to call if he/she needed counsel. 

Neal Sonnett was truly a legend and his passing leaves all of us a little worse off. 

Neal Sonnett 

RUMPOLE'S SUMMER READING LIST

 Summer means beaches, or mountains, or pools, or boating, or just lying around the house, and all are great places to read a great book. 

Here is our Summer Reading List. 

You Like it Darker. Stephen King. Another superb collection of short stories. Do not miss "Danny Coughlin's Bad Dream" which, without spoiling it, has a lot in common with what we all do. It starts slow but once it gets going, it is impossible to put down. Also- "The Fifth Step" is a very short, very classic King short story. 

The New York Game- Baseball And the Rise Of New York City. Kevin Baker. You think you know baseball, but you do not- especially the origins. The chapter debunking the Abner Doubleday story as the founder of American Baseball is great- as are the chapters about baseball in New York in the early 1900's. 

I am Pilgrim, Terry Hayes. You want a summer beach thriller? You got it. Extraordinary fun. 

An Unfinished Love Story. Doris Kerns Goodwin. Our preeminent historian on her life with her husband,  Richard Goodwin, who among other things, was a trusted John Kennedy speechwriter. 

Takeover. Hitler's Final Rise to Power. Timothy Ryback.  If, for some weird reason you want to know how a dictator finally comes to power in an otherwise civilized nation, then this is as good a book on the subject as you will find. 

The Outlier. Kai Bird.  The best biography on our 39th President- James Earl Carter. 

Wilson. Scott Berg.  Great Biography of Woodrow Wilson. 

The Maid. Nita Prose.  You want to read a perfect fiction story? This is as close as you will get. A gem of a book and a great read. We listened to it on Audible and it was even better. 

Unrequited Infatuations. Stevie Van Zamft.  The autobiography of the guy who has been standing next to The Boss since the early 1970s as they started out on a journey that would make rock and roll history. And truth be known, this autobiography was better and more compelling than Springsteen's. 

OPENING IN ALEC BALDWIN CASE

 Yes it is Monday morning quarterbacking, but the opening of the defense attorney for Alec Baldwin was a D+.  It was plain awful. There was no real theme. The lawyer sounded like he was reading from a script. He jumped into the facts without establishing a theme. 

For example- how about starting with.... "Accidents happen. But they are not crimes." 

Or  "This case is about a movie set where the safety director (with voice raise) failed to do his job, It was his job to make sure there was not a live bullet in a gun that was handed to Alex Baldwin (now lowering the voice and speaking very slowly) and  he   failed." 

Something....anything.... before  just beginning a rote and somnambulistic recitation of facts. 

Oh well....

2:37 or so it begins.

Not even a "May it please the court..." 

Very disappointing. 

In other news....Joe Biden is still really old and is too old to be President. 

TALK TO ME GOOSE

 You asked for it...you got it. 

The SAO (Motto "Playing chess with discovery and people's lives is coooool....") hired someone we never heard of.  Steve Gosney (sp?). 

Here's what the comments have mentioned. 

He worked as an ASA and APD up north Florida way. 

He writes self-published novels that have been described as misogynistic or disrespectful of women, religious, and pornography, and some nonsense about the death penalty to boot.  So not The Grapes of Wrath material.  Hard to understand how they can be all of those. If you Ven diagram it, for example, religious and porn seem to not have any overlapping areas, unless you are POTUS 45 and wave bibles you do not read while grabbing women in their private areas. 

He is on X (formerly Twitter) bemoaning entry into a political maelstrom. 

He was hired to (not 100% sure of this because the whole thing bores us frankly so we aren't paying close attention) to right the wrongs of MVZ. 

As Bruce Springsteen sings in Tenth Avenue Freeze Out in his concerts, "Now this here is the important point"- We invite Mr. Gosney to have the front page of the blog, no edits on our part- he can introduce himself, right (write) the wrongs or misperceptions, and maybe if we are feeling charitable- a link to buy his tome.  A certain judge who is also self-published probably just cursed out loud reading this. 

So again, in Springsteen terms.... "If a change was made uptown in the office and the big man joined the band SAO" he is free to explain his work/goals. 

In other words....TALK TO ME GOOSE

CONGRATS TO FFLA NEW PRESIDENT BOB PARDO

UPDATE FOR MONDAY MORNING - road closures for a walking event by the REGJB will slow your commute down.  

The Miami-Dade Courts X account is dope. 

 

Long time Miami Criminal Defense attorney, and former ASA at the Dade State Attorneys Office back when ethics mattered, Bob Pardo, assumed the Presidency of FFLA - the organization and what it does is listed below - which is from the Florida Bar Website. 

Coming Monday- and you're not gonna wanna miss this so get up around 2 am when it is scheduled to post - TALK TO ME GOOSE. 

Miami lawyer Roberto R. Pardo took office July 1, 2024, as president of FFLA, a statewide charitable organization whose mission is to increase access to the justice system for people of limited means by funding legal services, developing innovative tools and programs, and supporting legal aid providers and the courts.

Pardo practices in the areas of criminal defense and personal injury at his firm, Roberto R. Pardo, P.A., and is of counsel at Correa & Martinez. He earned his juris doctor from the University of Miami School of Law.

Pardo served on the board of directors of The Florida Bar Foundation, now FFLA, from 2007-2013. He rejoined the board in 2016 and has served on more than a dozen committees, including audit, budget and finance, grant allocation, investment, executive, and development.

Pardo served for eight years on the 11th Circuit Judicial Nomination Commission. He served as a director of the Cuban American Bar Association and was awarded CABA’s Presidential Award in 2021. He has served as a director and treasurer of the Miami chapter of the Florida Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers and as a director of the League of Prosecutors. Pardo served on the 11th Circuit Unlicensed Practice of Law Committee “D” and the Grievance Committee “B,” for which he twice received a Meritorious Public Service Award.

He is an FFLA fellow and member of its Bronze Society for lifetime giving.

A NEW PM

COMING MONDAY- You asked for it...you got it. TALK TO ME GOOSE

 Friday saw an extraordinary and yet orderly change of power in the world's oldest democracy. In England, Labour made a strong comeback after fourteen years of being the opposition. Once the results were in, PM Rishi Sunak was out, and Kier Starmer was in. No storming Parliament. No protests. No accusations of dead Venezuelan dictators fixing voting machines. No frivolous lawsuits.  No former mayors with dye running down their face holding ridiculous press conferences making outrageous lies (remember his formation of an "elite strike force" of lawyers to challenge the election? They lost every case, were not elite, and made our country a joke to the world). 

In a carefully orchestrated process that is hundreds of years old, Sunak went to the Palace Friday and told King Charles III he was resigning. The King accepted his resignation. Shortly thereafter (and in the past it has sometimes been less than ten minutes) the new leader -Starmer- arrived- and in a ceremony known as the "Kissing of the Hands" (although no hands are kissed) the King greets his new PM and asks him to form a government. The new PM agreed, and then they chatted for a few minutes and arranged a time for their weekly luncheon.  During that interregnum (you Desantis drones can Google that word) the King is the sole leader of Britian. 

Meanwhile the departing PM returned one last time to number 10 Downing where he was briskly moved out of his home within a day of losing the election. He made a departing speech and left. The new PM then showed up with his family and was greeted by the permanent staff with polite applause.  And a new government leads England. 

We may be proud of our democracy and american exceptionalism blah blah blah but exceptionalism is earned every day and we have not been exceptional for some time now. But England, dear England, always has been exceptional, especially in the worst of times. And now more than ever, the world needs the stability of England as we stare into the precipice of potential destruction of our country- rent by a dumb megalomaniac.  

Which reminds us of when Benjamin Franklin was questioned by a socialite shortly after declaring independence.  "So what do we have now?" she asked him. "A monarchy or a republic?"

"A republic if you can keep it" Franklin replied.  

Indeed. 

THOMAS JEFFERSON SURVIVES

 The John Admas -Thomas Jefferson feud is one of the most unusual historical occurrences of the Fourth of July. Both men were founding fathers of our country and compatriots at the time of the revolution.  When Jefferson defeated Adams for the presidency, Adans sent Jefferson a text   a note wishing him well. Jefferson did not respond and it started a feud where the men did not speak for over a dozen years. 

Eventually there was a rapprochement of sorts, but the men did not speak much, and their rivalry continued. Fast forward to July 4, 1826.  exactly fifty years after the declaration of Independence. Jefferson was 83 and Adams was 90. 

As Adams lay on his death bed, his last words as he knew his death was impending, were of his old friend and rival- "Thomas Jefferson Survives".  Adams then died. 

A few hours later, on July 4, 1826, Thomas Jefferson died. 

These two giants of men- their character and intellect and philosophical thought provided the foundation for a great nation, died hours apart fifty years to the momentous day when they brought forth upon the earth a society founded on principles of freedom and democracy. 

These principles, we argue, led to one nation amongst all others with the intellectual and industrial ability to land humans on the moon, to save Europe twice from oppression, and to  accept a statue of Liberty upon its shores welcoming those who want only a chance to use the abilities they have been endowed with by the creator. 

On this July 4, Jefferson and Adams survive- in thought, ideas and principles. 

Their nation hangs precariously on the precipice of losing the ideals they brought forth. But we are not scared. We have been here before and prevailed. 

We shall do so again. 

Happy Fourth of July. 

And now to the important  issue- what do you put on your hot dog? We are a brown mustard, with a dash of ketchup and relish type of guy. 

 

CLEENEY AMENDED ORDER

 This is the order that was filed.  The prior one was a draft. 

Pardon our delay- there was a federal judge in Los Angeles that kept us on our toes for the last two weeks. But all's well that ends in a rule 29. 

cleeney amendedorder by Anonymous PbHV4H on Scribd

WHY WE ARE VOTING FOR JOE BIDEN

UPDATE TWO: THE IMMUNITY OPINION IS OUT! : "We conclude that under our constitutional structure of separated powers, the nature of Presidential power requires that a former president have some immunity from criminal prosecution for official acts during his tenure in office. At least with respect to the President's exercise of his core constitutional powers, this immunity must be absolute. As for his remaining official actions, he is also entitled to immunity. At the current stage of the proceedings in this case, we need not and do not decide whether that immunity must be absolute or instead whether a presumptive immunity is sufficient. State v. Winton 522 So.2d 463 3rd DCA 1988" 

UPDATE: Good Monday morning. We expect the Supreme Court (Motto "Can anyone loan Clarence their private plane and yacht for the summer?")  to issue its decision on the Trump Immunity appeal today. 

WHY WE ARE VOTING FOR JOE BIDEN

 The President's performance in the debate last week was dismal. And that is being kind. Let's get that out of the way. He was awful, and he is likely too old to be an effective President. Our choice would be the nomination of the Vice President, or Pete Buttigieg the Secretary of Transportation, or Governor Gavin Newsom of California, or Governor Josh Shapiro of Pennsylvania, or Governor Jared Polis of Colorado, or Mutt Romney, retired Senator from Utah. 

But the reason we will vote to reelect the president is the competency of the government he has built. During the past three and half years we have had one secretary of state, one secretary of defense, one attorney general, one secretary of the treasury. In fact, President Biden has had one of the most stable administrations in Presidential history, Which means the country is being run by professionals. As opposed to the prior administration which had:

Four Chiefs of Staff; Four Secretaries od Defense; Three Attorneys General. 

The list of who the former president fired is extensive. And why did he fire them? Because they were good and decent people who openly expressed loyalty to the Constitution and the nation over the president. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson was fired via Twitter. He called the President a "a dumb son of a bitch". The first Secretary of Defense- Jim Mattis- an aesthetic Marine  who lived a quiet, bookish life in between his loyalty to the county and Corps resigned when he would not agree to the troop withdrawals the president wanted. And attorney General William Barr, the second of the Attorney Generals, resigned when he would not agree with the President's crazy legal theories about the election the president lost. 

Roughly 75% of the former president's original cabinet was gone by the third year of his term. And this from a man who bragged about hiring the best and brightest. And what we learned is that the former President does not want the best and brightest. He does not want a "Team Of Rivals" like Lincoln's cabinet, meaning he does not want independent thinkers who do not agree with him. He wants lackeys. And when North Korea is about to invade South Korea, or Russia threatens to invade Poland, or the economy edges to collapse, what we need are professionals in the room. People who are the best in their field and have spent a lifetime preparing for the moment when their country and the world needs them most. And what we know for sure is that Joe Biden will staff the government with those professionals. And the former President will not. 

We do not know if our republic and democracy will withstand four more years of a presidency by someone who open disdains the freedoms of our democracy. Someone who wanted to know why he could not call the military out to shoot the Black Lives Matters Protesters in the legs. Someone who admires, of all people, Vladamir Putin. 

These are dangerous times and we are very very worried. 

HURRICANE BERLY

There is a major Hurricane in the Caribbean. It went from a tropical storm to a Cat 3 within 48 hours, the fastest increase every recorded in a hurricane. Why? BECAUSE THE OCEANS ARE OVERHEATING BECAUSE OF GLOBAL WARMING. 

Which is another reason we are voting for the current President. There are approximately 30-45% of the American public who are so ignorant, so uneducated, and so frightened by global warming that they only way they can deal with it is deny it, and vote for morons who chant drill - baby- drill. 

The ice caps are melting. The oceans are the hottest they have ever been. And we have a major political party who believes that all of the news reports on global warming are engineered by Hillary Clinton, Hunter Biden, and ANTIFA. 

It looks like Berly will miss Florida. 

BELOW (prior post) - the Cleeny order.