Here is the startling news to come out of the workshop: (steady now) The court system is out of money, it works inefficiently, and the technology is thirty years old.
Yup, that is a big blow for most of you to read, but the truth will out no matter how difficult to hear.
ELECTRONIC FILING.
Electronic filing is the glaring example of Florida court system incompetence that we cannot figure out.
Roughly a decade ago the federal court system went to electronic filing. There are also electronic dockets. Anyone with access to the CM/ECF system can access any case and see any document (that hasn't been sealed) that has been filed. The government files discovery electronically, a sample of which we have included below.
As much as we hate to say it, the Fed system works. You can file the same document in Dallas, as in Miami, or anywhere else in the federal system and you file it the same way (except in Dallas where your pleadings have to include "y'all").
With this template before it, Florida apparently ignored the Feds. We understand the sentiment, but in this case Florida ignored the Feds to their detriment. Couldn't Florida have hired the same software developers? The biggest flaw in the Florida system is that the documents are not accessible. So If you come late into a case you can't simply go on-line and download the documents to get up to speed. The Florida system looks cheap, it acts clunky, there is this ridiculous requirement that if you don't enter the exact number of pages in the document the system makes you start all over. Overall, Florida bought a "compuserve" system in an Apple world. Or put another way, Florida has a rotary phone system in an iPhone world. Or put another way, they got ripped off and screwed. But that's technical legal jargon, better left for the civil blogs to discuss.
Basically, the Feds got it right and we dropped the ball. Ouch. There. We said it.
See you in court.
Here's an example of the wonderful discovery that you get in federal court, not including Jenks material, which as we all know must be disclosed within two dozen years after the verdict.
Broward cop throws man on tne ground, hits him and arrests him for no crime
ReplyDeletehttps://youtube.com/watch?v=UFR-cUgnDJQ
Rump: FWIW you can see the family law documents on line but nothing else. To view the fam law docs you must be attorney of record. In other words Dade understands the concept just to stupid to do anything about it.
ReplyDeleteYes, you made many good points. Once again, Florida is behind the times.
ReplyDeleteI believe PACER celebrated its 25th birthday already. http://news.uscourts.gov/25-years-later-pacer-electronic-filing-continue-change-courts
Two years ago a Florida Clerk of Court replied to your question that I asked, Florida wanted the federal CM/ECF-PACER system but could not get it for some reason.
The Portal's glitch about entering the correct number of pages is frustrating too. It happened to me, and I had to log off, and log back on to clear my mistake. Still, its way better than assembling and mailing tons of paper documents to the court.
And I understand trees are happy too.
In FLA its " Ya'all"
ReplyDeleteTo me, the Portal is slow, hard to use and does almost nothing to make an electronic system anything close to PACER. I too wondered why they didn't just purchase PACER.
ReplyDeleteHell, in Miami, we've been using SPIRIT for 15 years and it works but, when are they going to let us see the damn documents on line like you can in PACER?
I fully agree.
ReplyDelete"Y'ALL" is reserved for Georgia, Mississippi, and Alabama. For Texas, insert "PAHDNA"
ReplyDelete"Florida wanted the federal CM/ECF-PACER system but could not get it for some reason."
ReplyDeleteThe reason is the crooked politicos got contributions from the software salesmen. They did, and we bought the cr#p they sold.
You are correct. I stand corrected 11:26
ReplyDelete11:26, you saying Y'all ir Ya'all are NOT said in FLA? Why nit, FLA is the south, the 3rd state to succeed from the Union in the Great War Between the States ( what ya Yankees call the civil war)
ReplyDeleteIn fact Fla is the ONLY Southern State East of the Mississippi, whose capital was Not captured by the North in the War if Sothern Freedom
It is particularly frustrating to pro se litigants who cannot file electronically, cannot access filed documents except at the Courthouse and have to pay a fortune for copies instead of being able to read and print them at home.
ReplyDeleteThe system makes a mockery of equal protection of the law, makes the system relatively inaccesssble and violates the zuS and Florida Constitutions. Anybody willing to help me fight it?
ReplyDeleteRumpole. According to the persons I have spoken with in the Clerk's office, it will be 24-36 months before we have the capability to be fuly integrated into the E-filing system in the criminal division. CJIS is so antiquated that there is nothing they can do with the Miami Dade County model that will work. Every other county in the state is fully operational with E-filing.
Never a dull moment:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/hialeah/article11073590.html
http://www.dailybusinessreview.com/id=1202718777580/JQC-Charges-MiamiDade-Judge-Schwartz-With-Ethics-Violations?mcode=1202615581416
ReplyDeleteGotta get right on the new buddy ;)
http://www.floridasupremecourt.org/pub_info/summaries/briefs/15/15-312/index.html
ReplyDeletere Seth - pro se can file electronically, go to https://www.myflcourtaccess.com/default.aspx
ReplyDeletealso see Pro se e-filing gets the green light, June 15, 2014, The Florida Bar News
https://www.floridabar.org/DIVCOM/JN/JNNews01.nsf/Articles/1D15DE038992B2F085257CF200464DD2
Also see Portal’s pro se tools to remain free, January 1, 2015, The Florida Bar News
http://www.floridabar.org/DIVCOM/JN/jnnews01.nsf/8c9f13012b96736985256aa900624829/2faf97999568bf5085257db10072f113!OpenDocument
Fifty Shades of shumie.
ReplyDeleteBe thankful we have electronic filing at all. Im a fancy lawyer admitted in a number of states, some of which still do paper filing, and I frequently have to recommend local counsel just to make sure papers get stamped and filed in the correct stupid building and on time. I agree the portal blows and we should have followed the fed system long ago (who doesn't love instant timestamp and simultaneous email service), but at least you don't have to hire some runner in Duval County to scramble to the clerk's office by 4PM (or whenever they decide to close these days) to get something clocked in.
ReplyDeletere Kissimmee Kid said... re "Florida wanted the federal CM/ECF-PACER system but could not get it for some reason." - "The reason is the crooked politicos got contributions from the software salesmen. They did, and we bought the cr#p they sold."
ReplyDeleteOkay, fine. I'm not surprised. Now, how to fix this Portal turkey, meaning replace it with the federal CM/ECF-PACER system? Professional time is too valuable to spend tinkering with a Portal clunker, when a superior federal model is available.
Seems to me active lawyers have the biggest stake here. Why not organize and petition for change?
FYI, most Broweird judges, who have each been assigned email addresses for their divisions, are refusing to accept electronic motions and will not schedule a motion for hearing until they have a paper copy delivered to their chambers. Should I etch that in stone for you judge?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.dailybusinessreview.com/id=1202718939084/MiamiDade-Civil-Cases-to-Go-Paperless?mcode=1202615581416
ReplyDelete